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These Women Who Think They Don’t Need Feminism Don’t Know What Feminism Is

2 months ago

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RYOT POINTS

Screen Shot 2014-07-22 at 9.14.14 AM

All photos: Facebook/Women Against Feminism

The internet is weird sometimes. These days, I try to keep my online activity to a minimum. I generally stick to academic articles, the Beyoncé version of 2048, and pictures of food on Yelp.

But every so often, I’ll see something that I find so ridiculous that the little flame in my belly — usually set on simmer — heats up to high.

The most recent arsonist is a Tumblr called Women against Feminism which I first saw featured on Buzzfeed. The website, as the name suggests, is an antifeminist site that suggests that feminists wish to be victimized and that rape culture is a myth.

On the site, there are many photos of women holding up cards explaining why they don’t support what they see as an unnecessary, misandrist (man-hating) revolution.

think

But did these posters ever think to look up the actual definition of feminism?

girl doesn't need feminism 2 ugh

Just a reminder to the lovely ladies whose portraits are featured on the site, feminism is the belief that people of all genders are equal, and should be treated thusly.

If you don’t trust me, the Oxford dictionary provides a more thorough definition: “The advocacy of women’s rights on the grounds of political, social, and economic equality to men.”

weak

On much of the site, many posters express that they have never been victims of oppression. Under a heading like “Why I am against feminism,” the author ties her grievances to the applications of feminism that they currently see in society. She might write that women and men already have equal rights and that feminists are always trying to “punish” men and give themselves “special privileges.”

By “special privileges,” does the author mean being able to speak out about sexual harassment in the workplace without fear? And by “punishment,” does the author mean stricter legal action about rape on college campuses?

girl doesn't need feminism 4

Another bullet point explains that the patriarchy does not exist. If it did, the author writes, then women would not be able to “vote, divorce, go to college, have a career, etc.”

This is flawed thinking. While in the U.S. and much of the “Western” world, women are not legally barred from any of these things, many women across the world do not have access to these things. Thus, the author’s issues with feminism clearly lie in the Western world, and can’t be applied across the board.

chivalry

On the site, the authors don’t provide any statistical evidence or data to back up their findings. Perhaps if a little research was done about the recent Hobby Lobby decision that allows companies to restrict women’s access to birth control based on religious reasons, the ongoing debate over abortion, and the startling number of sexual assault cases where the perpetrator is allowed to walk free, they might reconsider their claims that we live in an already equal society.

Instead, it seems that the majority of posts seem to come from interactions and subsequent disagreement with Tumblr feminists. And it seems that the posters take issue most with the way feminism has played out in the Western world, a place that they believe protects the rights of both men and women equally.

victims

As a self-proclaimed feminist, I cannot help but see the flaws in their logic. The patriarchy is alive and well, and it is a double-edged sword.

It may restrict women from freedoms in some places and not others. Patriarchal mindsets affect not just women but also men. It creates a culture of insecure and anxious people who constantly feel the need to defend and prove themselves, their actions, the ways they chose to live life.

anthony

These women may claim that they don’t need feminism, but the rest of us know we do — and I’ll politely add that I think these women are mistaken.

We live in a culture where we applaud men for “teaching” women they’re pretty in popular songs, where a person’s integrity is questioned if they report being raped, where women of color and transwomen are more likely to be murdered than any other group in the United States. These are good enough selling points for me.

So..

40 Things Only Internet Feminists Will Understand

What about you? Do you need feminism?

Leave a comment to start a friendly debate.

RYOT NOTE from Lillian

Regardless of the terminology we use, the fact remains that women all over the world are still discriminated against and face injustices every day. RYOT’S #OperationGirl is raising money to empower women by investing in girls’ education. Click the action box to find out how you can get involved, and share this story to Become the News!

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Tagged:

equality feminism gender inequality tumblr womens rights
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134 comments
Anonymouse1991
Anonymouse1991

Here’s the thing though, you are operating on the dictionary definition of feminism, which claims to want equal rights for both genders. In practice, I see very little “equality” being fought for. I used to consider myself a feminist, and I am well versed in what the movement claims to be about. Then I met other feminists who told me my choice to be a teacher, mother, and wife are wrong… if I was really about equal rights, I would be in a male dominated field, like engineering. I began seeing the “don’t be that guy” ad campaigns (http://www.theviolencestopshere.ca/dbtg.php) which urge men to stop rape while ignoring that women also commit rape. I looked deeper into sexual assault laws and domestic violence laws, which heavily favour women. I watched my brother-in-law arrested for defending himself against his girlfriend (who later tried to run him over with her car). I was there when a friend of mine was not allowed to be present at the birth of his son, because it “stressed her out.” I watched women beating their husbands and being lauded as heroes by passersby on telvision (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZdddlzA2e4). I read about the only men’s shelter in Canada, which feminists fought to shut down. I looked deeper into the soundbytes like the “1 in 5 women will be sexually assaulted” and found them to be deeply flawed. I attended a seminar about domestic violence, which admitted the statistic they had (90% of DV being male-female) was inaccurate, then continued using “woman” instead of “victim” throughout the 3 hour presentation. I saw men being mocked and ridiculed by feminists for admitting they’d been raped. I saw this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iARHCxAMAO0 And after all this, I stopped buying into feminism.

I consider myself to be an equalist, also known as an egalitarian. The movement I’ve chosen is the same as many on the womenagainstfeminism tumblr have. Like “dictionary feminism,” equalism also believes in equal rights for men and women, but the approach is different. Feminism does not hold a monopoly on equality.

Believe in what you will, I’m not here to tell you you’re wrong. I just wanted to spread some light on what these women and I see, and to point out that actions speak louder than words.



Read more: http://www.gurl.com/2014/07/14/reasons-women-dont-need-feminism/#ixzz3DHJ6xa48

MidareBenten
MidareBenten

Egalitarianism is the movement of those that want true equality, nowadays feminist sound as if they had some sort of personal agenda to put women in charge.

Also, I'm pretty sure these women are against the now well known "tumblr feminism", which is far from what feminism used to aim for. Because of the pseudo feminists, many things are being ruined for everyone instead of being fixed. 

I'm a woman, I don't need someone to tell me rape it's wrong, I know this, and these new feminist seem to ignore women are not the only victims of rape. I don't need someone to tell me someone earning less money than other it's wrong, I know it's wrong, if both are doing the same job, and one is getting less money, regardless of their gender it's wrong. I don't need someone to tell me gender stereotypes in media and games are wrong... yet we see male stereotypes ALL the time, but nowadays feminist whine about it.

Yes, feminism is not needed, egalitarianism it's needed.

AmyDDavis
AmyDDavis

No its not just empowering woman. Its about defending " femininity". Feminist does not mean woman. It comes from the word Feminine. Femininity is found in both genders, and IS most often seen as the weaker gender. Most men have trouble dealing with their egos, suppressing anything about themselves that might come off as being a "pussy". Its not healthy for either gender to have to suppress those qualities, and neither is it healthy to discriminate either gender for this quality.  Because of feminism and like minded individuals there is being a further push for strong female lead characters in Hollywood( by the way, believe it or not, many chick flicks were actually written or directed by men). Dont forget, Feminism is actually something quite new, we still have grandmothers and grandfathers who lived in a time where they couldnt vote or sign a document or work, had equal pay, or able to become a member of congress or any other political figure. Its not over yet, and feminism is here to stay until the job is done ALL OVER THE WORLD.

kolbenito
kolbenito

Actually, there is already a movement for equal rights. It is called Egalitarianism. It has the socially viable distinction of being gender neutral. Feminism is, most of the time, a Women vs. Men discussion. 


Quite honestly most of what I read from Feminists is just "me too" man hating, lamenting they aren't on equal footing to the most powerful men (few are) and general griping. 

RapLordPita
RapLordPita

i am combating feminism for many of these reasons because feminism no longer (if it ever did) upholds gender equality. feminism has moved from womens rights to a revolution which seeks to make women social equals to men. That has long since happened. Women are EMPOWERED. 33% more women acquire degrees than men. So i don't see the need for further equality. Women are not rape victims as frequent as children! Rape has been given attention because of feminism but feminists arent active in child sex trafficking! At this point, it is a farce. Gender equality should be made just that. Gender equality.

MakedaTheGreat
MakedaTheGreat

I don't need feminism because honestly, if a guy was walking around naked he'd be arrested yet its supposed to be legal for women to do it? Men get raped, yet you do nothing for that? Some of us women are perfectly happy here, yet you do nothing for the girls being raped in India? Sweetheart, stop using the word feminism and use the word Equalism instead, before I start taking any of you seriously okay? Kisses. <3

MeZ_
MeZ_

Operationgirl is fantastic. Tackling the problem head on instead of just blaming men . the problem for feminists is that a big number of modern feminists have been quoted saying misanderist things in print or shouting them in protests, or protesting men's support groups etc. Because in their minds they think it helps to vilify men and create an enemy to rally against. But womenagaisntfeminism proves that not all women will by "collected" by the whole bigger enemy spiel that armies the world over gave been using to recruit young men for centuries. It is to young women's credit that it has stopped working with women so quickly.

AL102
AL102

You look like you're about 18 amber, what do you know about over 25 year olds?

AL102
AL102

Then maybe you'd prefer to have mens problems instead. Either way you're going to have problems. The difference is that men don't constantly complain about it in public.

If it's about teaching boys not to treat girls like doodoo, why are the topics raised by feminists about everything else but child raising.

I'm almost 60 and I've seen 40 years of putting men down. I see women making alliances with other "victim" who have together made the white christian male into some kind of demon.

My father told me before he died that it's a shame a man can't even help a kid thats fallen off of a bicycle without feeling like a child molester. 

In most of this country a man who gets a divorce is treated like a criminal by the courts that take the woman's  side in nearly issue that arises.

I see men being held in jail on baseless accusations by women who regret having had sex with him, and therefore retroactively call it rape.

It's time for women to take responsibility for their behavior and accept that they cannot have it all.

How could anyone expect men to continue treating women like queens when they now compete with him for a seat in the classroom and a decent job, not even on a level playing field, but on one skewed heavily in their favor.

Women seem to be completely oblivious to what they have done to men by deciding to turn society on it's head and relegate men to what? What are these men that get bumped out of an education and a job while they simultaneously only respect or deem worthy men who earn more money than they do?

What are men supposed to do now that women have taken men's breadwinner role? Make dinner?

And what did men receive from women in return for what has been taken from them? Nothing but the same expectations as before and expecting men to open doors for them as before.

They want authority and cash while they still cannot take responsibility for their own behavior and march endlessly for more choices and less responsibility for their own sex while mandating more and more responsibility for men.

Sorry but this cannot continue endlessly. Women who keep supporting this path are going to be very unhappy indeed, as many surveys have shown.



AmberLoewenthal
AmberLoewenthal

Most of these girls look like they are under 25 and have probably not yet had to join the working world. I'm sure they have yet to experience being with mostly men and having them ignore your ideas because they think you are a stupid girl. I'm sure those compliments about your body wouldn't feel so good to you if you have ever experienced walking alone at night and passing a group of men you don't know, aggressively catcalling you.  Feminism isn't about giving women more perks, its about teaching our children not to grow up to treat women like doodoo.  We need feminism because there is still a part of society that wants nothing from a woman but her body.  Women are so smart, creative, intuitive, and the world could do so much better if those traits were nurtured rather than ignored.

jacobr4d
jacobr4d

It's funny how pro-life women are sooo much better looking than feminists (read leftists).

jjordanlife
jjordanlife

I like the comment differentiating misandrist from feminist. That's definitely a good point. What I'm about to say may sound inflammatory at first, but stick with me. This is just my opinion.

Men are stronger than women so that men can keep women "in their place"( a place of freedom, security, and empowerment). Five men are stronger than one man so that when that one "stronger" man puts one "not as strong" woman in "the wrong place" (abuse, imprisonment, neglect), those five men can overpower the one and throw him off a cliff!

Of course, we've evolved as a society since stuff like that actually happened, but the nature is still there. A true feminist should be open to accepting her nature (one that thrives in freedom, security, and empowerment) while accepting man's nature (to create and protect that place). So, while receiving equal rights to vote and to be paid equally for doing the same job, a feminist could also feel complimented when a man's nature (chivalry) is directed towards her. Given the right opportunity, that man is inclined to elevate her to a place where she is the most powerful.

Misandrism (men hating) has been mistakenly touted as feminism in our culture. Misandrist women hate having doors held because they care more about hating men's nature to do that than they do about the advantage they could be receiving by accepting it. The culture of Misandrist women makes our society's men weak so that when one man overpowers the woman, there are no longer 5 men ready to overpower the one man and throw him off a cliff on her behalf. So, essentially, misandrists are making themselves vulnerable.

The long term difference between an misandrist and a true believer in the power of women can be found in Proverbs 31. The woman in that story is AWESOME! Just like most women are. But she didn't achieve that awesomeness alone. She had someone ensuring she would be left alone by anyone who wanted to see her fail. Therefore, she was able to build her empire without having to also looking over her shoulder to watch out for danger. Her focus was on the task at hand because she knew she was secure and didn't have to put down her future in order to protect herself from the outside world.

My advice to women is to vote and get paid well at whatever you do, but also to go ahead and let a man call you beautiful. Let him hold the door. Then find one who will dedicate his life to that kind of attention and marry him. Then let him be your watchman while you build your empire without one single worry in the world and with an undivided interest. You'll be much more productive that way and get WAY farther in life. Then, if that one man turns out to be a turd, you'll have tons of other men on your good side who will "throw him off a cliff" (whatever that means in our modern society) if he ever plots to tear you down.

And guys, don't be afraid of women just because a culture of misandrists yell at you for being you. If they want to make themselves weak and vulnerable in the name of feeling empowered, just find another woman who will let you actually empower her by doing what you're good at.

Just my two cents. Thanks.

AL102
AL102

The fact is most pedophiles are homosexuals, the feminists want you to think they're not because that means you'll want them out there fighting for "you". The oldest trick ever, scaring people to get their support.

I'm surprised most intelligent women have for so long allowed these people to scare them into fighting their own brothers, fathers, uncles, and cousins. What a pathetic bunch of people over there at NOW and their allies.

AL102
AL102

More proof that feminism is dying, they increasingly focus on alliances with gay rights groups and black rights groups, and Latino rights groups, or they want to talk about installing feminism in some foreign country. They do this to try to keep themselves relevant, but it's just baloney, there is nothing left for them to scream about any more in the USA, which is where we live and all most people care about.

For example, look at the pedophile stories you read about. Did you ever notice how when a priest or coach molests young boys they simply label them a pedophile?

Um, I think there is something missing in that description don't you?

How about calling them what they are? Homosexual pedophiles, because a straight man would never in a million years molest a boy.

This is just one example of how these feminist leaning writers consistently protect their fellow "victimhood" partners they have aligned themselves with.

AL102
AL102

It seems the author of this article is getting a majority of comments that blow her beloved feminist dogma right back to where it came from. It's time to get that Phd in women's studies and let someone else write articles, preferably not sexist ones.

AL102
AL102

Oh my gosh, the dreaded MRO people! But wait, I can't seem to remember any news articles or complaints from these huge male rights organizations at all, isn't that weird? I can't even remember any of the names of these powerful MRO groups, isn't that funny?

All that these feminists have done is preemptively discredited any male rights group that might even dare to pop up and tell them they are full of baloney.

Third wave feminists are a bunch of lesbians, and since when did lesbians ever give two hoots about whether they were damaging male female relations? the answer is they love messing those relationships up because it just generates more unhappy potential lesbian partners frustrated with the "system".

How refreshing that some women, young or not, are refusing to drink the feminist kool aid!

This is the beginning of the end for this damaging, destructive, anarchistic group that feeds off of people like vampires. Thank god for people with their own minds. Rock on girls!

MeZ_
MeZ_

More boys are raped than girls.. did you know that?   Think it's hard reporting sexual discrimination as a women?  imagine doing it as a man.   If your boss is a women you will not be believed by any other women and you will be scorned by men for either not being able to deal with it.. or for not just taking it and enjoying it..     If 500 men and 5 women apply for IT jobs, should the  IT company that has 95 percent male workers be blamed?   Should the 5 women all be given jobs just because they have boobs and the company wants to appear PC or should the actual person best equipped to do the job get the job?   


Nearly every modern feminist rant I hear now days says men are the problem and the enemy (or generalizations to that effect), and yet they then say they need to educate men.     Way to go convincing us to learn there.  I was originally a feminist supporter, but after watching the last few years, I'm now following the anti-feminist movement. I believe in equal rights everywhere..  but if a company has 95% male workers, I'll ask why qualified experianced females are not applying (or if they are) before i assume the company is to blame for being sexist.  If I was a feminist leader, I'd be encouraging females to get out there and apply.  I work in an IT area with more females than makes, so I know they are out there, but most of the people showing up to interviews for tech roles (for example) are men.


I've watched females in my workplace get promoted above me time after time, despite the fact that when they can't figure something out,they bring it to me fix.  I feel that getting promoted not because of talent but rather because the company wants to prove how women friendly they are is discrimination, because other than growing boobs there isn't much I can do to compete with that.


Two sides to every coin.. equality is about redressing ALL inequality.. not just the areas that benefit you best.    Feminism is not about equality.. its definition might be.. but now days it seems to be about other stuff.. sure, sexist stuff does still happen.   But that applies both ways.  I know two women that purposely got pregnant to hold onto or punish a man..   why isn't that a punishable offense?  Apply your brush evenly and stop letting the zealots among you speak on your behalf, and protest ALL forms of inequality  and perhaps women that object to your methods will stop forming splinter groups.

peace_love
peace_love

@MakedaTheGreat Your comment about nudity is illogical and unfounded. Can you provide information about that claim? Also, feminists are against anyone being sexually assaulted, regardless of gender. Feminists care about men and women being raped and are working to ensure that the rights of victims are upheld. Feminists also work for the protection of women's rights worldwide. Women are being oppressed in the US and in other countries, all of these issues are being discussed and addressed by feminists. Please do your research and educate yourself before making ignorant blanket statements! 

letsthinkaboutthis
letsthinkaboutthis

@MeZ_ I am a modern feminist. So is my husband. So are our sons. Modern feminism has nothing to do with misandery. It's all about respect and equality for both genders. 


It appears as if the founders of Women Against Feminism have been very successful in inciting hatred of some women towards others.  

Loganalan88
Loganalan88

You don't understand feminism. Feminists don't expect to be treated like queens and don't care if someone holds the door open for them or not. It's not that big of a deal. And how are women taking being the bread winner from men? Men and women can share that role now, and many men are happy to be stay at home parents just like some women. There's nothing wrong with that. Cite one real life case of a woman regretting sex with a man and trying to claim it was rape. What happens much more often is: a woman gets raped, then when she tried to bring her rapist to justice she is judged and humiliated and held responsible for the rapist's actions. And last time I checked feminists didn't claim all men are rapists or child molesters either. You're attacking a straw man of what you believe feminism to be.

MinnieMangafas
MinnieMangafas

@AL102 I don't think so. I'm pretty happy being a free person, knowing that I can work, make my own money and be independent. if you don't like the fact that women are also breadwinners, it sounds like you're the one who's going to be unhappy. Sincerely, a very self-fulfilled feminist. 

engineer1998
engineer1998

@AmberLoewenthal  I agree with you, I am a degreed Engineer and have been ignored and the advice of a non Engineer male has been requested and trusted over my own.  We had the same answer and yet it was not believed when the educated individual weighed in because they were female.

Anna153
Anna153

@jacobr4d its funny how you find the way they look as a more important factor to consider than their opinions and the reasons behind it.

gracesimply
gracesimply

@jjordanlife This is hands down the best comment I have EVER seen on the issues/arguments of Modern Feminism.  I have been struggling personally on whether or not to label myself a Feminist as I seem to hold similar principles and values to the definition.  But it's the ambiguity between that definition and what I'm seeing in actuality that I've struggled with - a whole lot of contradictions and more arguments about what TRUE Feminism is.


But reality is that not only has Feminism brought up the issue of Misandry but also Misogyny.  What's being described here is an Egalitarian society not a Feminist one.  For me Feminism has lost the value it once had and the title has become more of a hinderance then anything else.


DeeDee70
DeeDee70

@jjordanlife Thanks for bringing up the complementarian point of view. Your comment is much appreciated!

Anna153
Anna153

@jjordanlife Thank you. A culture where men and women not only allow each other to grow and be successful but also allow people to do so (if that makes sense) will lead to a truly progressive society where everyone can be successful.


I have seen the frustration when my brother thinks he is chivalrous when opening a door for a girl, where she reacts as if he took something from her, but then expects him to pick up the entire check and understand it. Especially since the opposite holds true in my family. We are all feminists that work, split the bills and the men are chivalrous while the woman nurture. Its called working together and exploiting each others strengths (like when the piano needs to be moved).


Loganalan88
Loganalan88

You're a pathetic person for telling such a malicious lie about gay people. Most pedophiles are heterosexual married men. That doesn't mean that all straight married men are bad, though. I'd never try to sink to your level and condemn an entire group based on a few bad eggs.

Loganalan88
Loganalan88

I think you don't know a damn thing about pedophilia at all. The gender of the victim isn't what matters. It's distinct from adult sexual orientation, which you'd know if you'd educate yourself about the psychology behind it. For instance, the Penn state coach molested boys even though he was a straight married man, most likely because they were more easily available to him. The overwhelming majority of pedophilesnare either straight men in their adult sexual orientation (which, again, Is separate from their pedophilia) or have no adult sexual orientation at all. You're ignorant and clearly a bigot,

Anna153
Anna153

@AL102 It is sad that the world has shrunken to the US when women in other countries need feminists to help bring their voices to places where it needs to be heard'.

Anna153
Anna153

@AL102 you are confusing feminism with misandry. please sort that out together with the "women who don't need feminism

grannybune
grannybune

@MeZ_ Did it every occur to you that your sexist attitude may be the reason that women are more successful in the workplace than you are?

danmurphey1956
danmurphey1956

@KaradinArt @RapLordPita What degrees are they getting though? Over-represented in the humanities (I'm a guy with an humanities degree, surprisingly not been handed my CEO position yet!), under-represented in STEM.

gracesimply
gracesimply

@peace_love @MakedaTheGreat Curious how the nudity comment is illogical and unfounded?  I get that we aren't talking about actual full-on nudity which Makeda The Great didn't clearly point out, (as a woman would certainly be reprimanded as a man would for complete nudity) - but why is it that a woman can go topless as a means of protest against oppression while a man wearing ass-less chaps would certainly be reprimanded for indecent exposure in some way shape or form.


That IS a double standard and as a woman I DON'T feel oppressed by the top I wear.


Fair enough though that Makeda's statement was a bit of a blanket statement but I wouldn't go as far as to say it were ignorant.  There is a HUGE difference in the level of oppression women face in North America versus other countries and this article we are commenting on highlights the issues of Feminism in a place such as our own.


I'm 100% with Makeda on this one in that it should be labelled Equalism versus Feminism as modern Feminism is not what it used be and has sadly taken a turn for the worst.  More people are arguing about what it is then the topics we are trying to address.


So before you tell someone to do their research and educate themselves maybe you should.  Take a look at the definition of Feminism, what it was in the past, and what it has become.  It is no longer as simple as the definition states.  We are all on the same team - man and woman... so why not call it Equalism?


And calling someone ignorant is rude.  Maybe Makeda has done her research and this is the conclusion they have come to.  Which thus makes you ignorant as you are coming to a conclusion without all of the facts... does it not?


ig·no·rantˈignərənt/adjective

  1. lacking knowledge or awareness in general; uneducated or unsophisticated."he was told constantly that he was ignorant and stupid"synonyms:uneducated, unknowledgeable, untaughtunschooleduntutored,untrainedilliterateunletteredunlearnedunreaduninformed,unenlightenedbenightedMore
    • lacking knowledge, information, or awareness about something in particular."they were ignorant of astronomy"synonyms:without knowledge of, unaware of, unconscious of, oblivious to,incognizant of, unfamiliar with, unacquainted with, uninformed about, ill-informed about, unenlightened about, unconversant with, inexperienced in/with, naive about, green about; More
    • informaldiscourteous or rude."this ignorant, pin-brained receptionist"

gracesimply
gracesimply

@letsthinkaboutthis @MeZ_ While I am certainly not in full agreement with a lot of the things that are written on Women Against Feminism by any means... I do relate to the message that is being portrayed.  There are people who feel we don't require Feminism and that it is doing more harm then good.  And as Feminists have an opportunity to speak their minds so should their  opposition without being accused of ''inciting hatred'.  While your family may practice a healthy form of Feminism, society as a whole right now is not.


I've been looked down upon (or received 'hatred) by Feminists for not completely agreeing with the movement and I do see myself as an Equalist.  The hatred goes both ways and has nothing to do with being Feminist or Anti.  The founders did not cause this so called 'hatred' they merely provided a platform for another point of view, which is obviously shared by a lot of people.

augurae
augurae

@letsthinkaboutthis @MeZ_ So you are the typical dangerous "liberal" family that would vote for a modern Hitler in a whim if the media told you to?

MeZ_
MeZ_

@Anna153. No. What is funny is that feminists apparently fight to give women a voice and then tell them what they s

Are saying is stupid. And you vilify men for doing that yourselves. But the unalterable point is that lots of prominent feminists have made man hating statements so they have a point about egalitarianism. A man tipped acid on a woman causing cosmetic damage only ( in Europe ) and he got 10 years jail and she got 1.8 million in compensation. A women tipped acid on a man who dumped her and massively disfigured him, and blinded him. She will get off with no jail time, a suspended sentence and he got no compensation at all. In what way is that a fair outcome for gender? I will stand against anyone that isn't actually for egalitarianism. I suggest most thinking people do the same

gracesimply
gracesimply

@KaradinArt @jjordanlife I don't see where jjordanlife implied that strength was the arbitrator in life?  What I'm reading is that typically a man is physically stronger than a woman and thus can protect her from physical harm from another stronger being.  He's not saying they are appointed to but have the ability to protect women and should.  And if majority of women are 'pushing' men away through misandrism they may be less willing to help... not necessarily through retaliation but not wanting any conflict for insulting a woman's 'independence'.


Men DO elevate women in healthy relationships just as women elevate men... same could be said for women elevating other women.  I'm not sure why you would find this so insulting?  Sure a woman can do fine without a male partner but they can and often do do better with one. 


This isn't mythology - it's fact.  This isn't knights and princesses - it's a mutually beneficial relationship.  I'm an adult and I still like fairy tales - there are some extremely good life-lessons in there if you read between the lines.


And it's all FEMALES in general that want a fair shake not Feminists - and as a female this post represents what I want for the most part.  I've never been barred from an education, job opportunity, or choices because I am a woman - nor has anyone I know.  It WILL take time for the ratios to balance out but I'm not sure it has anything to do with being a woman in todays society as much as us catching up.  Are we REALLY that oppressed?

AL102
AL102

@Anna153 @AL102 I think all of would support more equitable treatment of women in other countries, however, if the fallout from the attitude "man bad, woman good" continues to land here in this country men, and some women here are not going to support it because as things are now feminists in this country are lumping all men together, which is wrong on many levels. I see why they are doing it, but the real war here, which is and has been a war on men in this country, really has to end for male female relations to heal. 

Additionally, women must support real equality for men and women in all areas because today men are the ones being discriminated against by a wide margin and everyone knows it.

AL102
AL102

@Anna153 @AL102 Well, as I said, I believe that the feminist movement has been hijacked by strident lesbians. I cannot imagine men following or supporting a movement that claims it is representing their interests that was so infiltrated with gay men and aligned with gay groups as the feminist movement is. It's just counterintuitive to think that gay people have the same agenda straight people have when it comes to their respective rights. Wouldn't there naturally be a collision between the interests of the two in many areas?When it comes to misandry,I believe that is one driving force in the lesbian movement which I believe they would like to encourage in their members and in society at large because it helps their cause. It helps their cause that their members are as indoctrinated and as hostile to men as possible, which snowballs into more unhappy women hating men more and so forth. 

gracesimply
gracesimply

@KaradinArt @MeZ_ So am I understanding this right?  Men have to wait for women to get their equality for them to start fighting for areas where they feel oppressed.  That doesn't seem to fit the definition of Feminism given that it's about equal rights to ALL which includes men.  


"Men will have respect when they earn it."  Are you implying that women are entitled to respect regardless of whether they earn it simply because they are female?


Do you actually think there are that many males out there who still feel the need to oppress women to feel superior?  I'm sure there are just as many females out there oppressing other women to feel superior as there are men... possibly even more so.


If I'm reading this correctly then I feel confident in labelling you a misandrist.

Anonymouse1991
Anonymouse1991

@danmurphey1956 @deleted_61546765_KaradinArt @RapLordPita That might have something to do with women's interests though, rather than any "patriarchy" telling us what field we should go into. Honestly, the only people who have shamed me for getting my degree in early childhood education (a field I am passionate about because I love how children learn and express their knowledge, not because kids are cute) are feminists, BECAUSE women are under-represented in STEM field.


Many places offer special grants and assistance to encourage women to move into STEM, and they're still at a low male;female ratio because most women WANT to be in the humanities.

Loganalan88
Loganalan88

That's a neat little immature ad hominem attack augurae. Next time try saying something of substance instead of tearing someone down.

Loganalan88
Loganalan88

Of course, a few feminists made misandrist statements so ALL feminists must be bad. What a logical argument. And I'm pretty sure most feminists would not be okay with a wife disfiguring her husband. Once again, judging all feminists by the actions of a few and using straw men.

AL102
AL102

@MeZ_ What is really telling about the feminist movement is that when the equal rights amendment's passage seemed almost inevitable, women's groups stopped supporting it, and in fact undermined it so that it failed to be passed. Lots of under the table arm twisting occurred.

Was it Phillis Schafly? Not sure, but it was a prominent conservative woman who pointed out to NOW that if equal rights passed, women would lose all of their "privileges.

Interesting that a women openly noted that women would lose all of their privileges back in the 60 and 70's when women were supposedly still being "oppressed".

On a side note, I took my son to his college orientation and they had a photo of the first class to graduate with their 4 year degree, 6 out of 8 of the graduating class were women, that was 1889.

Also, were you aware that the first women to receive her MD degree in this country earned it that same year?

Women kept themselves back, men were not keeping them down. They were afraid to disobey their parents and pursue their dreams. It was not society that kept them down, it was their own hesitation to disobey their parents. I, as a man felt obligated to obey my parents too, does that mean I was a suffragette too? Today's kids don't have that problem.


Loganalan88
Loganalan88

Wow, between this and your post falsely conflating male homosexuality and pedophilia you've certainly manged to show the whole internet what an ignorant bigot you are.

Loganalan88
Loganalan88

Yeah, men have never, ever restricted the rights of women (like the right to vote) or held them down in any way ever.

These Women Who Think They Don’t Need Feminism Don’t Know What Feminism Is

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